Talk: Daranios

Greetings Daranios :) A warm welcome to the Forgotten Realms Wiki! Zerak ^talk 21:15, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

Toolbar[]

Regarding this question: By using the "wikipedia" monobook skin the toolbox and navigation box will be on the left side, instead of the right, to change skin go to Special:Preferences, go to the "skin" tab and chose the Wikipedia skin MonoBook. Hope that helps, if not, let me know! :) Zerak ^talk 20:56, 19 November 2007 (UTC)

Great template[]

Good work on the {{Zakharan pantheon}} template! Fw190a8 06:11, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

:-) Thanks! Mainly a matter of copy and paste. Daranios 16:02, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

Page numbers[]

I couldn't help but notice that on the Zann article, you have included an 'f' after the page number on the citation from The Complete Sha'ir's Handbook. What does this 'f' represent? Fw190a8 20:23, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

It should mean "and the following page". I have seen that in quoting systems before, but I have not looked up if this is usual with established quotation rules in this wiki or wikipedia. One could of course also write p. 41-42 or p. 41, 42. What do you think is best? Daranios 15:56, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

I think the f is rather unusual - it's certainly new to me. Personally I would use p. 41-2 or p. 41-42 for a range of pages, and p. 41, 56 for two different non-consecutive pages. I think it's more intuitive than the f symbol. In actual fact, if more than one page is referenced, p. should change to pp. but our template system is incapable of doing this automatically, but never mind! Fw190a8 01:59, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

Oops, I tumbled over what I only believed to know. I think the f is actually a German citation convention. Thanks for telling. Daranios 10:57, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

Wow, that's good to know, in case I run into it again. Any time you want to create a german version of this wiki, feel free. There are only 3668 articles to translate! ;) Fw190a8 06:33, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

Return to active editing[]

Hi! Good to see you're active again! Fw190a8 17:54, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks :-)! My presence here will stay erratic, I guess. As (almost) always: So much to do, so little time. Daranios 18:16, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Avoiding blanket categories[]

Please try to avoid so-called "blanket" categories like Category:Kara-Tur and instead use specific categories such as Category:Locations in Kara-Tur or Category:Inhabitants of Kara-Tur. People who come to the wiki seeking information will use specific categories to look for information regarding locations or inhabitants, then refine their search by continent, region and then perhaps city. People who come to look for generic information on Kara-Tur will start with the Kara-Tur article, which will provide links to all Kara-Tur-related information. Putting everything related to Kara-Tur in one "super-category" creates a large unstructured category making it harder to find articles. Fw190a8 20:29, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

I started out with Al-Qadim with the idea of organizing articles according to campaign (sub-)settings, centering around Category:Campaign settings. This would be a real-world oriented structure parallel to the in-universe structure with categories like Category:Inhabitants of Kara-Tur. That might be helpful for anyone asking: Hey, what information is out there regarding the Al-Qadim campaign setting? For Kara-Tur the situation is somewhat mudded as the campaign setting and the continent share the same name.

Please tell me if such a structure, which would not disrupt the in-universe structure, as e. g. Category:Locations in Zakhara is included in Category:Al-Qadim as well as in Category:Locations by continent, is generally unwanted. Or should there be a discussion about it?

If it is not dismissed outright: Would it be better to rename Category:Kara-Tur in Category:Kara-Tur campaign setting? Would Maztica and the Hordelands qualify as such sub-settings or not? What should they be called? Daranios 16:18, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

I think that some more discussion on this would be great. I have begun something at Forum:Consensus on "blanket" or "catch-all" categories so that everyone can provide their input if they so choose. Fw190a8 23:29, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Specific citation[]

Regarding your comment on this edit, yes, it should be specific enough so that each statement on the page is attributed to at least one source. See Castle Obarskyr for an example! I noticed you placed the citation in the section header - it is more conventional to place it at the end of the sentence or paragraph. In this case, I would place it after the colon but before the list begins. Placing it at the end of the last item in the list would imply that it only applies to that last item. Fw190a8 16:37, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Good idea, thanks. I had been dimly aware that it's not usual to place references in headers, but I saw the same problem you mentioned if I placed it at the very end. And one reference for each line in the list, meaning also one for each consecutive page in the source, seemed to be overdone to me. Daranios 09:12, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Category questions[]

Hi, I've responded to your comments on my talk page! Fw190a8 05:06, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

RE:Dead deities[]

You know I didn't know that there were two seperate portals, it's been a while since I've been around here. Thanks for showing me that, I'll revert the edit. Johnnyriot999 09:43, 6 February 2009 (UTC)

Call to edit[]

I wanted to issue a "call to edit" for all our regular editors who haven't been active recently, so I'm writing on their talk pages! The activity on the wiki has dropped recently but there's still a lot of work to be done to move it forwards, so if you can spare some time to return to editing, it would be much appreciated!  Fw190a8 (talk · contr) 22:06, October 6, 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for the invitation. At the moment I am very busy at Wikipedia and especially trying to improve Dungeon & Dragons Wiki (and then there is real life...). I hope to be back here when I am finished with my main issues at those places. Keep up your good work here! Daranios 14:52, October 7, 2009 (UTC)

Merge where?[]

Daranios, I appreciate your Al-Qadim articles... it was a great campaign... I have left talk pages on the creature lists... some of the info on these pages is the same as the main Monstrous Compendium Al-Qadim Appendix or Monstrous Compendium Kara-Tur Appendix, so the info from the lists needs to be moved to those pages... it also seems like some of the info was copied directly from [1]... I would recommend asking Cronje, he is one of our newest admins and is very insightful and knowledgeable. Please, no hard feelings, we all care about the Realms on this wiki, but we also want things to be organized and not plagiarized :) Darkwynters 17:37, June 20, 2012 (UTC)

Daranios, cool... we'll see what others say and keep up the great work on preserving the history of Al-Qadim :) Darkwynters 19:07, June 20, 2012 (UTC)

Dyes?[]

Daranios, perhaps you can help me here... you have Category:Dyes cat... and Category:Items from Zakhara, but Uther is redirected to a city??? I am guessing Uther (dye) is actually a dye and Uther (city) is another name for Qadib, right? Darkwynters (talk) 16:31, October 4, 2012 (UTC)

Actually, Uther is the name of a yellow-orange dye produced and heavily used in Qadib. I guess, there is nothing more to say about it, so I just included that as the last sentence of the Qadib article and made Uther into a redirect there. But it still is a dye, so I put that category to the redirect, just in case anyone was browsing categories in search of such a specific item. Daranios (talk) 18:04, October 4, 2012 (UTC)

As I understand it, the Three Sentence Rule may be violated in cases where a thing may potentially turn up somewhere outside it's parent article, as stated with the Star Ruby example at Forgotten Realms Wiki:3 Sentence Rule. People may travel, goods can be traded, while buildings and districts are strongly tied to a city and do not (easily) relocate. The uther dye may well be traded to another city or all the way to Faerûn, so it's not specifically tied to Qadib, even if it's produced there. So it should be okay to make a full page for uther, even at three sentences or under. (For example, I did something similar with Fiddlehead soup.) -- BadCatMan (talk) 02:01, October 5, 2012 (UTC)

In any case it reads nicely the way you did it, no more confusion about categories etc. And acutally I am counting five sentences now ;-). Daranios (talk) 13:12, October 5, 2012 (UTC)

Wow, I made Five sentenses... hehe, glad you like it... People always say I talk too much, which is how I can turn a sentense into FIVE :) Darkwynters (talk) 17:40, October 5, 2012 (UTC)

Copyright material[]

Hey, Daranios... I saw you cleaned up the Kadarasto page... great work... I reloaded the page with a clean history as per our policy... if there are any other pages with copyright history, please let me know and I will clean them for you :) Darkwynters (talk) 18:49, October 12, 2012 (UTC)

Actually the majority of the Zakharan city articles seem to have been mainly copied from source material. Apart from Kadarasto I have now changed to the best of my ability Dihliz, Hawa, Qudra, all Cities of the Heart and all Free Cities of Zakhara. On the other hand, Medina al-Afyal and Rog'osto seem ok to me. The others I did not check yet. Daranios (talk) 10:40, October 13, 2012 (UTC)

Good work! I'll begin deleting and restoring them. --BadCatMan (talk) 11:36, October 13, 2012 (UTC)

Can you confirm that Huzuz and Wasat are now entirely original? Not all the sentences were changed, so I wondered if you'd missed a bit. Thanks! -- BadCatMan (talk) 11:42, October 13, 2012 (UTC)

You were right, there were some more phrases in Huzuz I missed, which I changed now. I hope I have found everything. Wasat seems ok to me. Daranios (talk) 16:11, October 13, 2012 (UTC)

Huzuz and Wasat are now clean... great work, Daranios!!! Darkwynters (talk) 16:42, October 13, 2012 (UTC)

And that's all the articles in that list deleted and restored fresh. Thanks! — BadCatMan (talk) 13:13, October 14, 2012 (UT

Great :-). Daranios (talk) 15:37, October 15, 2012 (UTC)

Wei Gehts?[]

Just a friendly hello and how are you. I just finished rewriting the Plane of Shadow page and I noticed there was a link to a German version. Do you (or someone) translate pages from other wikis into German (and vice versa?), or is it more of a link between similar wikis? Just curious. Hope to see you around :) —Moviesign (talk) 14:55, December 17, 2012 (UTC)

Danke, gut! :-) I have done little at the German site, and not recently. I think it is more a link between similar wikis than a translation. Faerûnpedia is certainly active, they have created many new articles since I made a round to connect all fitting articles here and there, but I am not sure how they go about it there. Daranios (talk) 16:54, December 18, 2012 (UTC)

Edits[]

Daranios, I might have told you this before, but... Awesomely fantastic work on your Al-Qadim pages!!! Darkwynters (talk) 22:02, April 5, 2013 (UTC)

I've just been looking through your work too Daranios and it is brilliant to have someone like you here, especially with regards to your specialism in Al-Qadim. Any way we can make him a featured user Darkwynters? Or maybe revive the old awards system.--Eli the Tanner (talk) 23:05, April 5, 2013 (UTC)

Thanks a lot! I wanted to do these lesser Zakharan deities for some time, and now at last could find the time and energy. To hear that you find the articles worthwhile is just as good as any awards :-)! Daranios (talk) 19:51, April 8, 2013 (UTC)

Yes, it's nice to read about these exotic, far-off locales and strange gods. Thanks for working on this forgotten corner of the setting. :) However, can you please try for a more standard wiki arrangement, by starting with the name, then saying what it is, before launching the rest of the lore? This helps with consistency across the wiki and makes it easier for later expansion. Thanks! — BadCatMan (talk) 13:13, April 7, 2013 (UTC)

Ahm, I did that for The Faceless God, right? I couldn't find a good beginning for that article there. I will try to remember that for the future. Speaking of standard arrangement, what do you think of the beginning of the Ragarra article, then? Is this still fine, or should all articles exactly start with "Xyz was..."? Daranios (talk) 19:51, April 8, 2013 (UTC)

Sorry it took me a while to get back to you. Yeah, the Faceless God. Your original was actually very cool and evocative, however I had to go for the standard encyclopaedic format, to identify the subject first and then explain. It's bland but efficient. If you're at a loss to start, then the standard way to begin most wiki articles is "[Name of the article] was a..." and the rest follows on. Ragarra was fine, though since I made some edits, I chose to adjust the beginning the same way. — BadCatMan (talk) 13:23, April 14, 2013 (UTC)

By source[]

Happy new year!
You have deleted the "inhabitants by source" categories. Would you tell me why you think they are not useful? Thanks! Daranios (talk) 12:16, January 1, 2014 (UTC)

Daranios, Happy New Years to my favorite Al-Qadim fan :)

The pages in those categories were Creatures, not Inhabitants... but you do make a good point, do we want to have categories on "Inhabitants of the Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting 3rd edition" or "Creatures from the Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting"? This might be a lot of work... I wonder what High admin BadCat and admin Movie think? - Darkwynters (talk) 18:12, January 2, 2014 (UTC)

Hmmm... First, do we agree that Inhabitants are named and/or unique entities and Creatures are not? That's what I'm going with for this discussion. If an article is about an inhabitant, then it should be fairly obvious from the references which source the info comes from, and it might be more than one. If we categorize inhabitants, somebody like Elminster would be a member of 50 different "inhabitants by source" categories...is that useful to anyone? If we categorize Creatures by source, then what we have is a duplicate of the Table of Contents of the monster manuals, plus whatever the novels and other sourcebooks have added. I think the "Appearances" section of an article could mention that Cleric X or Monster Y appeared in a particular novel, etc.

I can see one use for "inhabitants by source": A list of all characters that are mentioned in a novel or sourcebook. Say you wanted to know if a book had Regis in it. You could look at the Category:Inhabitants by Book Title and see if the Regis page is linked. However, I think it would be more useful if the book's wiki page listed all the character's names (and perhaps the page number they appear on, for obscure characters). Either way, it's a lot of work. All in all, I don't see the Category system being very useful for this sort of information—it should go in wiki articles instead. I'm open to hearing counterarguments about this, so convince me :) —Moviesign (talk) 20:06, January 2, 2014 (UTC)

Good points. Creatures & people like Orcs or Elminster would probably get a mention in dozens...possibly hundreds of sources so I think the Category system would not be best either. The Appearances section (and references themselves) could be more rigourously included in articles perhaps? As for the sources themselves, then some of them have a format of listing any creatures/characters in them, which we could follow? e.g. Dungeon magazine 88 and Dungeon magazine 75 try to do this.--Eli the Tanner (talk) 00:23, January 3, 2014 (UTC)

As for the use of such categories, I had in mind just what Moviesign has stated. I think that would apply to both characters and creatures. For creatures specifically, the advantages compared to a table of content in a monster manual (do we have those for all monster books?) would be that 1) you will often start out search from a creature and then jump into the category, while you will use the table of content only when you start out search from a monster book page, and 2) the category will show you what articles are indeed present. Those points could however also be partly fulfilled by good referencing as was just suggested Eli the Tanner, and I also see the problem with lots of categories for articles the likes of Elminster. The work would be small for the deleted categories the discussion started with, creatures contained in Monstrous Compendium Al-Qadim Appendix and Kara-Tur Appendix, but rather large if expanded to all characters and creatures. Thus I would be happy with a decision either way. Daranios (talk) 13:42, January 3, 2014 (UTC)

Take a look at what Eli did on City of the Spider Queen. I think this is more useful and less work than categories in this case. Also, if you start on a Creature page, you can use the "What links here" button to find other articles that mention that creature. —Moviesign (talk) 20:01, January 3, 2014 (UTC)

I agree... using the "Appearances" section is a great way to state where "Creatures" or "Individuals" are located based on source material :) - Darkwynters (talk) 22:49, January 3, 2014 (UTC)

In this case for many books containing creatures (but where the article has no list yet), lists could be copied from the various Wikipedia:Lists of Dungeons & Dragons monsters, that are organized by edition and then by book. Daranios (talk) 18:03, January 4, 2014 (UTC)

As invited, my 2 cp. I agree, I don't see a need for categories by source, as lists of inhabitants/creatures can be handled at the source's article itself. Plus, it would lead to yet another proliferation of categories. Categories should be a way of collecting information from many sources across the entire franchise (say a type of character from sourcebooks, novels, comics, video games), not from a single source. — BadCatMan (talk) 13:20, January 5, 2014 (UTC)

Kadarastro[]

I'm not sure if it's a typo, but the Golden Huzuz sourcebook has it spelled "Kadarastro." Artemas (talk) 15:08, May 28, 2015 (UTC)

Ah, interesting. That has to be a typo there, however. I double-checked and Land of Fate (and Ruined Kingdoms) does consistently spell it Kadarasto. I will make redirect from Kadarastro just in case we stumble over that typo again. Daranios (talk) 20:10, May 28, 2015 (UTC)

I figured that's what it was. I still need to get my hands on Land of Fate, Ruined Kingdoms, and Cities of Bone so I can check all of these. :) Artemas (talk) 20:29, May 28, 2015 (UTC)

If you should have any question about those sources until you can get them, don't hesitate to ask :-) (though to Cities of Bone I have only indirect access). Daranios (talk) 20:27, May 29, 2015 (UTC)

Custom User Box[]

Do you know how to make a custom User Box for the profile page? I noticed some of the Admins have "Forgotten Realms Expert" (or similar) user boxes on their profile pages and thought it would be fun to get one for you and I saying "Al-Qadim Expert" or "Zakharan Expert." Thoughts? Artemas (talk) 12:20, July 11, 2015 (UTC)

I like the idea. I don't really know how to make one, but maybe I can figure out how to adapt one, give a bit of time. Did you have a specific existing one in mind? Daranios (talk) 14:08, July 11, 2015 (UTC)

See Category:Userbox templates for all the available templates. If you don't find one that suits you, then copy the code from one of them and change the image and/or the text. I'll be happy to help if you need it. —Moviesign (talk) 15:34, July 11, 2015 (UTC)

Thanks Movie! I like the Template: User Expert one but would want to change the background to something more Arabian and have the stars appear in front of the image. I guess the text could read: "This user is an Al-Qadim expert." Artemas (talk) 19:34, July 11, 2015 (UTC)

Someone created that image and put the stars on it, which requires some kind of image editing software that is probably more advanced that Microsoft Paint :-/ You can upload a background image and use it in your copy of the template. I might be able to add stars using software at work, but I'm no artist. You get what you pay for :D —Moviesign (talk) 19:49, July 11, 2015 (UTC)

I found a nice small box image that would work. Do I just upload the image under photos? Artemas (talk) 20:44, July 11, 2015 (UTC)

Yep, just be sure to fill out an {{Information}} template or at least give a source for the image. Then replace the one in the code you are copying with the name of your uploaded file. —Moviesign (talk) 20:55, July 11, 2015 (UTC)

Ok, I've got the image and text copied but how do I actually make a new user box template?? Artemas (talk) 22:29, July 11, 2015 (UTC)

Edit Template:User expert and type CTRL-a to select all and CTRL-c to copy it. Then start a new page and call it Template:User Al-Qadim expert (just click this red link). Paste your copied code into the blank page. Then change the file name of the image to your new file name, replace "Forgotten Realms" with "Al-Qadim", change the sortkey on the category from "Expert" to "Al-Qadim Expert" and save your changes. Voila! —Moviesign (talk) 22:54, July 11, 2015 (UTC)

Awesome, thanks for the help! I just added the template. Love it! I might try to use MS Paint and add some stars later on. Artemas (talk) 00:11, July 12, 2015 (UTC)

Thanks to both of you! I have grabbed onto the template right away :-). Daranios (talk) 11:59, July 12, 2015 (UTC)

Tome of Magic pages[]

Here are the new elemental spells and their page numbers in the Tome:

Elemental Air: Lasting Breath (19), Ride the Wind (23), Alamir’s Fundamental Breakdown (24), Suffocate (43), Airboat (43), Elemental Aura (46) Elemental Earth: Fist of Stone (17), Maximillian’s Earthen Grasp (22), Alamir’s Fundamental Breakdown (24), Maximillian’s Stony Grasp (26), Turn Pebble to Boulder (33), Hatch the Stone from the Egg (40), Elemental Aura (46) Elemental Fire: Fire Burst (17), Flaming Sphere, Pyrotechnics, Alamir’s Fundamental Breakdown (24), Forest’s Fiery Constrictor (38), Malec-Keth’s Flame Fist (41), Elemental Aura (46) Elemental Water: Metamorphose Liquids (19), Insatiable Thirst (21), Alamir’s Fundamental Breakdown (24), Watery Double (27), Acid Storm (40), Abi-Dalzim’s Horrid Wilting (43), Elemental Aura (46).

Page 151 has the spell lists for all of the elemental spells. Let me know if you need anything else. Artemas (talk) 12:33, August 2, 2015 (UTC)

Sandmen?[]

Do you know what these are, or which sourcebook they are mentioned in? Artemas (talk) 20:12, August 14, 2015 (UTC)

Art, The Great Wheel cosmology page has a link to the sandman and it is referenced with the Planescape Campaign Setting page 38 :) - Darkwynters (talk) 20:28, August 14, 2015 (UTC)

Jep, that Planescape page says that sandmen also live on the Quasielemental Plane of Dust. Daranios (talk) 20:52, August 14, 2015 (UTC)

Project Request[]

Saheeda! As part of my Ethnicity Project, I just created the Zakharan (ethnicity) page. However, I only had access to two 3e sourcebooks, which were both Faerûn-focused. Would it be possible for you to help expand the article?

Also, are there not any pictures of a typical Zakharan anywhere?

Shukran in advance.

~ Lhynard (talk) 23:02, October 11, 2015 (UTC)

Shukran for creating the article in the first place!

From my recollection and a very short look at books I think there is very little information about the outward appearance of Zakharans in the 2nd Edition Al-Qadim material, though there is lots and lots about the culture (including garments), but that is also shared by the demihumans of Zakhara. Are you looking for any specific point about the Zakharans that might not be covered in the limited 3rd edition material?

The sourcebooks contain lots of pictures of Zakharans (though few of them where they look you as statically into the face as on the images of Races of Faerûn), but I am not sure about the copyright issue if one would just scan some. Should I point out some of them? The authors/artist seem to have had nothing more specific in mind than any character which might appear in the One Thousand and One Nights, so any images from those tales or pictures of traditionally garbed Arabs might be used as a demonstration, even though they are not from Al-Qadim sources (e.g. Harun al-Rashid (left) or Fisherman and Genie). Lastly, looking a the book covers we already have, Land of Fate, Arabian Adventures and Reunion show us men in action, City of Delights, Assassin Mountain, Caravans and Golden Voyages feature women with very different, ah, occupations. Daranios (talk) 17:19, October 12, 2015 (UTC)

The parts lacking currently, IMO, are sections for Outlook, Society, (which could include clothing styles, or that could go in the "Description" section,) Religion, and History.

I am not in favor of using non-D&D images in the wiki to illustrate FR things, so if we find any pictures, I think they should be from sourcebooks. Photocopied images are okay, if they are low-resolution and "fair use". If a sourcebook has an image of a key NPC, it is fair use to use that image on a page about that NPC. If that NPC happens to be Zakharan, we can use it as an example image for the ethnicity page.

Cover art is not quite so helpful. (Also, I think all of those images look like Europeans in Arabian garb, not like true Zakharans. :( )

Maybe we are just out of luck and there are no such images.

~ Lhynard (talk) 02:35, October 13, 2015 (UTC)

Can you tell me just how low "low-resolution" has to be for fair use? I gave it a try to add an image of Tannous al-Assad, but a look at Wikipedia:Fair use#Fair use on the Internet seems to indicate that thumbnails are ok, which again seem to mean 200 pixels in the larger dimension, making the image rather ugly to look at. Daranios (talk) 13:18, October 13, 2015 (UTC)

See my brief discussion with User:Lhynard here and do what you think best. —Moviesign (talk) 13:51, October 13, 2015 (UTC)

FWIW, most of the "fair use" images on Wikipedia itself are not 200px on their longest side. They are closer to 250px on their shortest side. ~ Lhynard (talk) 01:59, October 14, 2015 (UTC)

I also did not find much of anything useful about the Zakharan ethnicity in my Al-Qadim sourcebooks. As far as images of Zakharans, how about a section on the page that has a few sample pics of human Zakharan males and females? I can scan and upload a few that I've found in sourcebooks. Artemaz (talk) 14:15, October 13, 2015 (UTC)

Now I actually found a rule of thumb on Wikipedia for the low resolution (provided other criteria are met): 100,000 pixels. That sounds pretty useable. Daranios (talk) 14:59, October 14, 2015 (UTC)

There are now images of the four human members of the court in Huzuz in Category:Images from Land of Fate - maybe not exactly representative for the average Zakharan, but there they are. (About the cover art looking like Europeans in Arabian art: That's in conflict with the 3rd edition description of Zakharans, but in tune with one important source for the flavour of Al-Qadim: Older Hollywood B-movies.) Daranios (talk) 11:42, October 15, 2015 (UTC)

Great. That helps those pages a lot. Thanks! ~ Lhynard (talk) 02:12, October 16, 2015 (UTC)

Phew, with Artemaz putting in a typical image of a Zakharan, we have worked through your suggestions. I quite like it, so I have put a line into the "Did you know..." for the front page. If you can see any further improvements, they are welcome of course. Daranios (talk) 15:22, October 18, 2015 (UTC)

Great work, both. Thanks for the help! ~ Lhynard (talk) 04:35, October 20, 2015 (UTC)

Mongrelman[]

Hey Darianos, thanks for editing the Mongrelman page! I am not sure whether they are monstrous humanoids or aberrations, as they were descended from beings magically created by a wizard(could also fall under constructs, but I doubt that since they could reproduce) called Mongrelman Infiltrators which I have yet to make a page for. Do you have a source for pathfinder? That would be great! Edit: I just looked them up in the 3.5e Fiend Folio. Mongrelfolk as they are called there have completely different lore from mongrelmen in 2nd edition. In 3.5e they are definitely monstrous humanoids since they are descended from mixing different races, rather then being descended from a constructed doppleganger-like species. Gem Hound (talk) 20:05, November 19, 2015 (UTC)

Sure, the Pathfinder source can be found here. In the Wikipedia article I have seen that Fiend Folio has 3rd edition info on the mongrelman, this would be an official source for the creature type, but I do not have that book. I think 2nd edition does not have systematic creature types the same way 3rd edition does. Anyway, I encountered the red links for mongrelman and crabmen in different places, it is really nice to have the articles now! Daranios (talk) 20:16, November 19, 2015 (UTC)

Yak-men[]

Hi Daranios! I have a copy of the MC page for the Yak-man and want to make a page here, but I don't know what the source is. Do you know where it came from? It's not from the Monstrous Compendium Al-Qadim Appendix. Artemaz (talk) 15:49, March 10, 2016 (UTC)

Hello! Great, yak-man/yikaria is (next to the Loregiver) my personal most wanted Al-Qadim article at the moment. The MC page is from Land of Fate, it should also say so in the upper right corner. In case you have access to Dragon magazine 241: "The Roof of the World" article has lots of details about the empire and culture of the yikaria. Daranios (talk) 20:42, March 10, 2016 (UTC)

Excellent, thanks! I'll make the Yak-man page a priority for today. I don't have access to that other article, but if you do then hopefully you can add to the page after it's created. Artemaz (talk) 14:50, March 11, 2016 (UTC)

Hey, references wise I was basing all of that from the book 'Hordes of The Abyss' so I'm wondering how would I go about referencing that? And thanks for reintroducing those previous references.

Spell Years[]

FWIW, yes, I, for one, would love to see the dates spells were invented added to the wiki. ~ Lhynard (talk) 21:02, April 8, 2016 (UTC)

Good to know, thanks! So I will keep adding them when I come accross them. Daranios (talk) 11:24, April 9, 2016 (UTC)

Regions of Zakhara[]

Great job on North Zakhara! Are you planning on doing the other Zakharan regions as well? Artemaz (talk) 12:51, April 9, 2016 (UTC)

I plan to do Southeast Zakhara and Northwest Zakhara soon - except if you would like to. For the others, I am not so keen. I might do some more later, but would be happy if anyone else has the inclination. Daranios (talk) 13:33, April 9, 2016 (UTC)

Genie type?[]

I know I'm missing some MC pages from my Land of Fate boxed set, so I wanted to check with you about this. I just made the Lufala page and the source said she was a tasked harim servant genie. I haven't come across any "harim servant" genie data yet. Is this another kind of tasked genie like Slayer genie, Guardian genie, etc? Artemaz (talk) 13:52, April 28, 2016 (UTC)

Indeed, harim servant genies are another kind of tasked genie. They are described in the MC pages of City of Delights. If you are interested, the creatures detailed in these pages are: Winged cat, crypt servant, afanc, al-jahar, tasked administrator genie, tasked harim servant genie, Zakharan ogre, opinicus, a number of parasites, pasari-niml, singing tree, sirine, talking bird, tatalla, vargouille and elemental vermin. Daranios (talk) 15:13, April 28, 2016 (UTC)

Oh wow, I'm missing tons of MC pages then. Thanks for the info! Artemaz (talk) 15:27, April 28, 2016 (UTC)

Locathah Plural[]

It was a 3e vs. 2e thing. It was pluralized with ess in 3e and not in 2e. I prefer the 2e way myself, so I'm not reverting your change, but I figured I'd let you know why I originally put the ess. :) ~ Lhynard (talk) 12:26, May 22, 2016 (UTC)

Ah, I see, interesting. I had the non-s-version in the back of my mind and then judged from the Locathah article. Daranios (talk) 17:08, May 22, 2016 (UTC)

Dragon #241 Yak-Men Article[]

Do you have any idea what the table on the bottom left corner of the map page for this article is detailing? Artemaz (talk) 14:53, August 16, 2016 (UTC)

Actually yes: The Birthright campaign setting has rules for characters ruling a realm. In Dragon magazine 233, the "Scions of the Desert" article offers a way to use these rules for the Al-Qadim campaign setting - I am not quite sure how much we could draw from that article, as it presents a somewhat alternative version of Zakhara. The stats block in Dragon magazine 241 follows up with the corresponding data for the provinces of the yak-men. Do you want me to go more into detail? (The blood leech realm spell also belongs into that set of rules.) Daranios (talk) 18:27, August 16, 2016 (UTC)

Hmm, might be worth looking at, especially regarding the Coral Princess who was said to be exceptional at blood theft. Do you think the Birthright info would conflict too much with the Realms wiki? Artemaz (talk) 19:27, August 16, 2016 (UTC)

I think some parts of "Scions of the Desert" can fit in fine, like the merchant families described there. Maybe also the seven followers of the Loregiver. But that rulers usually would need to be from one of these seven bloodlines would be a big thing to add, as never being mentioned in the Al-Qadim material. It could be added and marked as non-canon, but the one realm spell from the article does not make a lot of sense if no other realm spells from the Birthright setting are present. Daranios (talk) 20:00, August 16, 2016 (UTC)

I'll take a look at that "Scions of the Desert" article and get back to you. Artemaz (talk) 20:07, August 16, 2016 (UTC)

2nd/3rd edition split in magic[]

Hi Daranios.

I saw your comment at Incantatrix. To distinguish between 2e and 3e in spells and such, I like to use the year: the Year of Wild Magic, 1372 DR. It sets the date and suggests a change in magic like the Time of Troubles, Spellplague, and Sundering do (even though it was the only time there wasn't a magical catastrophe). — BadCatMan (talk) 10:23, August 30, 2016 (UTC)

Thanks a lot! I was looking for a list of these edition split events, but could not find one. Daranios (talk) 15:02, August 30, 2016 (UTC)

Co-Project?[]

So, I see on your user page…

(Perhaps: Add introduction of spells from Netheril: Empire of Magic to years articles, see -2020 DR, etc.)

…and also…

...given enough time. Help appreciated, of course.

…so I have created a Project page for us, since this is something I have wanted to do/have done as well.

It's a huge task, so having a definitive list to check off will be helpful.

~ Lhynard (talk) 23:53, September 3, 2016 (UTC)

Great! with caveats: Real life is keeping me very busy, and I plan to continue/finish several other projects before getting more into this one. But I am already looking forward to getting the Netheril info into the existing spells a bit further in the future (though I don't see myself in creating the missing articles so far). Daranios (talk) 13:55, September 4, 2016 (UTC)

I have the same caveats! I tend to only work on an article or two per project per week, so I won't be much faster. ~ Lhynard (talk) 16:25, September 4, 2016 (UTC)

Featured Article[]

You and I should team up to try to get a few Zakharan articles up to "featured article" status. Interested? Artemaz (talk) 21:22, October 21, 2016 (UTC)

As so often, lots is going on for me. But if time is not an issue: Sure, would be a nice thing to have! What would you have in mind? With Al-Qadim being 2nd edition only, the criterion "comes from multiple sources" might not be easy to meet, but then again it is not a fixed one. Daranios (talk) 13:59, October 22, 2016 (UTC)

Time is definitely not an issue as I would imagine it's going to take awhile to get a Zakharan article up to featured status. Huzuz might be a good place to start. Artemaz (talk) 21:47, October 22, 2016 (UTC)

I think any criteria like that can be waived in order to obtain a Zakharan FA. They're like-to-haves rather than must-haves. And I really want to see a Zakharan FA. :) — BadCatMan (talk) 08:36, October 23, 2016 (UTC)

Sounds good to me! Having a product named after it has to count for something after all. Daranios (talk) 19:38, October 23, 2016 (UTC)

Slack[]

Hey, not sure if you're interested, but I'm hoping to set up a bit more of a community feel around the wiki moving forwards, so I've set up a Slack group. Unfortunately it needs email addresses to invite people, so I've set up a form to anonymously collect them. If you are interested, would be great if you can fill out https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSfoVCqUNSPCKTp77IxhwMDyIQ4UGVoB1AP0MM15agNUZsU94Q/viewform and leave your email so that I can send an invite!  Fw190a8 (talk · contr) 09:47, July 8, 2017 (UTC)

Joooiiin uusss... —Moviesign (talk) 00:37, July 11, 2017 (UTC)

:-) Thanks for the invite, both of you. I'll have a look at it these days (though there always is the time constraint for all (extra) acitivities). But what is it actually? Daranios (talk) 19:46, July 11, 2017 (UTC)

Slack is basically a chat room for collaboration and socialization. —Moviesign (talk) 19:53, July 11, 2017 (UTC)

Form filled out. Daranios (talk) 15:33, July 12, 2017 (UTC)

Invitation sent. —Moviesign (talk) 16:51, July 12, 2017 (UTC)

Burning Lands[]

Have you seen any text information on the Burning Lands of Zakhara? I'm still looking but have so far only seen this region on maps/cardsheets. Artemaz (talk) 22:04, July 12, 2017 (UTC)

As far as I know "Burning Lands" appears only on this map (though I don't have A Dozen and One Adventures so far), so think you made the best of it. I found one mention of the "Burning Land" in the introductory section to the tasked genie in the Monstrous Compendium Al-Qadim Appendix, but from the context this rather seems like a confusion with Zakhara's title as "the Burning World". Daranios (talk) 20:55, July 14, 2017 (UTC)

Classic Editor[]

I saw that you edited Carceri and got hit by the bug that reproduces the content of the {{Cosmologies}} template at the bottom of the page. I think this is caused by using the "classic" Rich Text editor which has trouble with certain templates. If you switch to one of the other editors, I believe you will not have this problem. You can set your editor choice in your Preferences. We recommend you use the Source editor, but you can also choose the Visual editor which has a button to switch to Source mode, just like the classic editor does. Let me know if you have any questions. —Moviesign (talk) 00:05, September 29, 2018 (UTC)

Thanks a lot for the tip! - I had that problem a number of times now. I'll try that. 20:42, September 29, 2018 (UTC)

Flush[]

FYI, yes it does say flush. Presumably using spores like tear gas but that's just speculation.

Vegepygmy (talk) 01:36, July 20, 2019 (UTC)

That's both interesting and confusing. Thanks for letting me know! Daranios (talk) 14:30, July 20, 2019 (UTC)

Uridezu[]

What did you mean by 'which edition of extinction'? It's the War of the Spider Queen novel.

Vegepygmy (talk) 23:50, August 16, 2019 (UTC)

Hello! Glad you ask: You will see in the Uridezu article that the citation of War of the Spider Queen - Extinction produces an error, because there are actually two different citation templates, one for the hardcover edition (ISBN 0-7869-2989-8) and one for the paperback edition (ISBN 0-7869-3596-0). Could you please tell me which one you have used, or put it into the article yourself, so that we can get this citation to work? Thanks! Daranios (talk) 12:44, August 17, 2019 (UTC)

I believe it's the paperback edition if I'm not mistaken. Vegepygmy (talk) 13:43, August 17, 2019 (UTC)

Allright, I have adjusted that in the Uridezu article. If you want to be sure and still have the book available, you can check out the ISBN number. The paperback has 0-7869-3596-0. Daranios (talk) 18:43, August 17, 2019 (UTC)

Discrepencies[]

Hello. I'm having timeline problems myself, although it's more thanks to 4e having to try to reconcile 5e and making the same mistakes of rewriting things because...well because reasons.

So in 5e Baazelbul got in trouble with Asmodeus in an event that seems completely unrelated to the Reckoning. I was wondering if you knew of anything that might explain this or if I should just write it off as the typical "Some say this but others say this" that has become unfortunately typical.Vegepygmy (talk) 21:19, April 5, 2020 (UTC)

Sorry (also for the late reply), but I have no ideas about this. I am familiar with lots of Planescape material, but know only bits and pieces about later stuff - basically nothing about 4th and 5th editon outside of what I see on the Wiki. I actually stumbled upon the Azharul bit only while searching more info on Tiamat. Daranios (talk) 07:37, April 9, 2020 (UTC)

Bound genies[]

The "bound genies" category covers genies serving others who were both forced against their will or willingly agreed to some kind of service contract ... so yes some of them are slaves but not all. Artemaz (talk) 16:02, May 9, 2020 (UTC)

Ah, ok, so I guess the Category:Slaves does not fit completely, even though that would fit to literary sources, like "I am the slave of the lamp" or some such from Aladdin. I was trying to get this into the inhabitants category tree somehow, because Category:Genies falls under Category:Creatures, and the Category:Bound genies contains both. Maybe adding Category:Inhabitants by rank would be better? Daranios (talk) 18:36, May 9, 2020 (UTC)

Martek[]

Sorry, I was not informed that you had asked in the talk section of the Inner Sanctum of Martek. There is only one indication I can find as to when the library was stacked: one of the posters reads "Visit Beautiful Cormyr", and it's unique to the DoD Realms compilation, being a "Visit Beautiful Barovia" poster in Lost Tomb of Martek. Stabbier (talk) 23:28, 14 September 2021 (UTC)

Thank you for stopping by, Stabbier! And sorry, I did not see this earlier. I am not very familiar with Desert of Desolation. So I assume that does not really tell us when these adventures take place, right? Daranios (talk) 19:55, 30 September 2021 (UTC)

We do not in fact know when. I've done some work on timing it, though, but I've started from the assumption it takes place around 1356 DR, per BadCatMan's judgement. All we know is that it is a 1E adventure, which means sometime around 1357. From there, I took the following assumptions: first, that Khalitharius has been imprisoned for 1000 years (roughly the year 350, thus), and Martek has been alive for some time after that, though perhaps not long after. That's a spell, so I'm taking it to be the most exact timing bit: the spell ends at a thousand and one years, Martek foresees peeps a thousand years later.

However, since he owns a poster reading "Visit Beautiful Cormyr" which wasn't present in the non-Realms version, all we know is that he must've died at some point AFTER the naming of Cormyr, but probably no later than 370 DR, since he too has been gone for about 1000 years; 980 years is kinda pushing it. Exactly when someone would make and sell this lad the poster becomes our only timing clue, but since Cormyr was built in -26 DR, we've got like 400 years' worth of slack. You can visit the Martek page, for my full attempt at timing the events. Stabbier (talk) 17:08, 2 October 2021 (UTC)

Hey, that's still quite cool: So we can assume that the Inner Sanctum of Martek was built and furnished some time between 350 DR and 370 DR, right? (Or at least between 300 DR and 370 DR, according to "Martek began preparing for ... somewhere around the year 300 DR."?) Which again means all the books present must have been written before 370 DR. So for the List of books (in-universe) we could write as date written "Before ca. 370 DR", or more cautiously but more cumbersome "4th century DR or earlier". What do you think?

Another thing, are you ok with my copying our discussion to Talk: Inner Sanctum of Martek, so that interested people can find it? Daranios (talk) 10:38, 4 October 2021 (UTC)

Feel free to copy it. Again, I'm taking the spell to be the exact bit, but someone with a different assumption might very well reach a different conclusion. And yeah, I think 4th century or earlier is kind of our best shot at timing this. That Martek began preparing around the year 300 is kind of a weird thing... but it is what fits with the stuff that the book says, so, there's that, I guess. Cheers Stabbier (talk) 01:36, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

Great, I'll do that. Daranios (talk) 19:07, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

Tiamat[]

Hey there. Just FYI Tiamat was explicitly stated to be same as Takhisis in DMG5e p225. Her and Bahamut are likely to be reiterated to be the same gods as the ones from Krynn in Fizban's. -Artyom.pavlov (talk) 20:41, 9 October 2021 (UTC)

Hello Artyom.pavlov! Thanks for letting me know! I didn't realize that entry in DMG5e. I'll be interested to see what news come up in Fizban's :-). I kind of thought the connection had been denied somewhere much earlier, but when searching I just found the old Sage Advice entry which did connect them in just the way that I as a reader of the sources would have connected the dots. Daranios (talk) 08:54, 10 October 2021 (UTC)

To be fair, DMG mentioned them but the statement that they are one and the same is in the Orb of dragonkind item entry. TSR and Wizards definitely flip-flopped on the topic. I dove into searching stuff on that earlier in the year. There was an out-of-universe statement that Dragonlance authors took Tia and Baha and just renamed them for the new setting. And somewhere in 4e there was an off hand ref that stated they were the same. I can dig around and get the books and pages if you ever need em. -Artyom.pavlov (talk) 14:19, 10 October 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the info and the offer. I think I won't need those sources in the forseeable future, but good to know that they are there :-). Daranios (talk) 16:03, 10 October 2021 (UTC)

Year of Miracles[]

If you want to chat a bit more frequently about the Year of Miracles Project, please feel free to jump on the FR Wiki Slack chat. I believe you have an invitation from some time past. Join us! Ruf (talk) 14:11, 4 January 2022 (UTC)

Hello Ruf! Thanks a lot for the invite! It's just not feasible for me timewise for the forseeable future. See you around! Daranios (talk)