File talk:Serbia1918.png

Unification was "ratified" by the King in 1918-12-01. This map is a construct it has no historical value, hence it should not be used. Many could object to this map. For instance Montenegrin historians. There should be only historicaly proven maps, namely the map of the 1^st December 1918 of the Kingdom of Serbs, Croats and Slovenes. Imbris 01:45, 6 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

On 1918-12-01 was ratified unification between Kingdom of Serbia and the State of Slovenes, Croats and Serbs. This map show borders of the Kingdom of Serbia BEFORE it united with the state of Slovenes, Croats and Serbs. Here you can see very similar map: http://www.terra.es/personal7/jqvaraderey/193818BK.GIF PANONIAN (talk) 10:53, 6 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

You are showing a fabrication. If the proclaimed alliance of State of Slovenes, Croats and Serbs happended in 1918-11-24 and the union proclaimed (not ratified) 1918-12-01) then when were "ratified" Bačka, Banat and Baranya's unification, and the unification of Syrmia. On the same day 1918-12-01. So another of your maps is a fabrication. Imbris 18:56, 7 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I will nominate it for deletion. Imbris 18:56, 7 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

No, it was not on same day - according to my history book for secondary school the unification of Kingdom of Serbia and the State of Slovenes, Croats and Serbs happended on 28.11.1918. i.e. two days after Kingdom of Serbia already united with Srem (24.11.), Vojvodina (25.11.) and Montenegro (26.11.), so this map show borders of the Kingdom of Serbia from 26.11.1918. The map from the external link that I showed to you prove that this is correct, no matter that this map have a slight mistake in the case of Srem. In another words: you should not delete facts simply because you do not like them. PANONIAN (talk) 19:28, 7 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I said that I will nominate it for deletion not delete it. Your history book, where was this book published, where. And they could have proclaim what they want in the Bačka, Banat and Baranya (they were not Vojvodina then, but Bačka, Banat and Baranya in the alphabetical order. We should not use any mistification about Banat, Bačka and Baranya and its statehood.

To conclude: Central comittee of the Peoples council of the State of Slovenes, Croats and Serbs had a session on the 23.11. they discuted until midnight had passed and it was 24.11. They were the governoment of the State and had under the Statutes power to decide for the Peoples council (when the Council itself had not been sessioning). They have decided for the State (but not for the Kingdom of Croatia, Slavonia and Dalmatia with Rijeka, Medjimurje, Istria, Bay of Cuttaro, etc.). They have set to travel on the 28.11. but departed from the Main Station in Zagreb in 29.11. (Then they have traveled for 27 hours, at the time).

The unification has been proclaimed by the King (who had not abaided the Constitution of Serbia, only The Peoples Assembly of the Kingdom of Serbia had such a power). Delete the map yourself - it will only save time It's a historical construct not a fact. Imbris 20:11, 7 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

You might be right about one thing: the historian Drago Njegovan also mention that State of Slovenes, Croats and Serbs decided on 24.11. to unite with the Kingdom of Serbia, but the official unification was on 1.12. and that is why Serbian historians claim that Vojvodina, Srem and Montenegro united with Serbia before State of Slovenes, Croats and Serbs and that in the time when State of Slovenes, Croats and Serbs united with Serbia (on 1.12.), Vojvodina, Srem and Montenegro were part of Serbia in this unification. Tomislav Bogavac in his book "Nestajanje Srba" also provide similar map of Serbia (that include Vojvodina, Srem and Montenegro), and similar map could be also seen here: http://www.terra.es/personal7/jqvaraderey/193818BK.GIF - you will notice there that border between Serbia and State of Slovenes, Croats and Serbs is marked with black colour, while borders of Vojvodina and Montenegro are marked with white colour marking them inside Serbia. Regarding Vojvodina, its official name was Banat, Bačka and Baranja (Banat was first in the name, no matter of alphabetical order), but Vojvodina was also unofficial name used for it. Also, the statehood of Banat, Bačka and Baranja was de facto reality - it had its own army, government, etc... PANONIAN (talk) 10:52, 8 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

You can lie all you want. I hope that the future will bring an another kind of a generation in Serbia, a democratic one. You clearly are not one of the inhabitants of Serbia that the World and Internationall community neads in this heavy time. The future will bring your people to the truth, to the chatarsis. They will delete all of your disinformations. Mark my words. No Greater Serbian project will succedde. Imbris 23:59, 8 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

If you look my edits, you will see that I mostly edit articles about "small" Serbia and therefore you have no single proof to accuse me for "Greater Serbian project". However, it is nice that you posted this racist opinion about Serbs which is simply another confirmation who you are and why you are here. Regarding "my lie", I lie nothing, just quote books, and if you do not like what those books say, it is your problem. PANONIAN (talk) 13:31, 9 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

To me that sounds just political, and not a racist condemnation of all Serbs. He was complaining about anti-democratic Serbs as opposed to democratic ones. Perhaps (indeed I hope so) he has simply gotten a false impression of your political views, and misunderstood.K. Lásztocska

Condemnation of ALL members of one nation is one of the descriptions of racism. Also, according to his definition, "democratic Serb" should be a Serb who give most of his country to his neighbours and left in Serbia only some small land between Belgrade and Kragujevac - sorry, but that is not democracy. The true democracy would recognize right of Serbs who live as majority in their land to choose in which country they would live, so when he learn something about democracy, then he can talk about it. PANONIAN (talk) 17:52, 13 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Who condemnated you. Funny. And it is clear that you deliberately write something that is not the truth. When I said anything about giving up territories. Shameful. You twist every thing someone other than you say. Even you twist yourself. Abolishing the Autonomy of Vojvodina, as Belgrade did 1989-2001 is just wrong, and majority will decide to separate them selves from Belgrade just like Kosovo --- Imbris 04:27, 20 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]