Talk:Sport of athletics

I have come across a wiki page of an athlete, Siddhanth Thingalaya who happen to be a good friend of mine. But his wiki page is missing lots of information about his latest achievements. Can anyone help me update his wiki page?

Kiran247 (talk) 11:19, 15 September 2017 (UTC)Reply

I have made a proposal to fix incoming links to this article here. Please add your thoughts. SFB 14:59, 15 May 2018 (UTC)Reply

what is name of 32 athletes 27.34.29.124 (talk) 15:18, 6 December 2022 (UTC)Reply

  This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 9 January 2023 and 5 May 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Jahyrenlee09 (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by Jahyrenlee09 (talk) 18:29, 23 January 2023 (UTC)Reply

atlethics 119.94.184.175 (talk) 13:38, 12 March 2023 (UTC)Reply

• Glad this ended as no consensus because this issue is not as simple as it first appears. It's worth reviewing previous move discussions which resulted in the establishment of the current title "sport of athletics". It is the only title which is unambiguous in a natural and technical sense and allows for the development of the subject without constant wars over English variations and scope. There is a reason why this awkward title has been stable and not had edit wars. It's the same reason why the international governing body of the sport uses the phrase "sport of athletics" in its own publications[1].

1. Athletics cannot be used because this is synonymous with athletic activities and college sports in general for a large portion of users
2. "Athletics (sport)" cannot be used because it fails to disambiguate the sport of athletics from the above athletic activities
3. "Athletics (organised sport)" cannot be used for same reason as above
4. "Athletics (track and field)" cannot be used because this constantly resulted in editing arguments about whether sport of athletics = track and field (it does not) and results in American editors changing the article to effectively cover the same subject as track and field.
5. "Track and field athletics" cannot be used for the same reason as above and because this actually means track and field, not the wider sport of athletics

• Although "sport of athletics" is an awkward phrase, it is a phrase used within the literature and organisations for the sport and one which allows Wikipedians to easily disambiguate the topic from both athletic activities and its subset of track and field. The previous ones also generated an enormous amount of confused wikilinks on such a scale that those issues remain unresolved today. SFB 20:11, 25 August 2023 (UTC)Reply

I read through this page and found it's mixed terminology confusing. I do not wish to enter--or reopen--the naming discussion, but I find the inconsistent use of terminology on this page confusing. It's peculiar that there is a seperate page for 'track and field'--I'm guessing for political reasons?-- but why does this page switch from talking about the sport as athletics to calling the facilities used "track and field stadiums" its bizarre. For the sake of continuity and clarity, shouldn't it just be athletic stadiums? after all, that's how they are referred to in the countries in which the sport is known as athletics. I propose the sections are altered to fit with the the rest of the article. SteadyJames (talk) 13:05, 8 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

@SteadyJames, thanks for this. Putting aside the regional naming differences entirely, "track and field" is not the same as "sport of athletics" because the former usually doesn't include road running, race walking (on the roads), or cross country running, while athletics specifically includes all of those disciplines.

So, "track and field" is a big part of but not entirely representative of athletics, and the concept does deserve mention on the article. Now, presuming this article is written in European English, maybe we could call track and field "in-stadia athletics" instead in this article? But that term is rarely used and awkward sounding. And calling the stadiums "athletics stadiums" can be confusing as well because not all athletics events are contested in stadiums (see street meet).

I don't think there are any satisfying answers here. In the long run, I hope that both "athletics" and "track and field" terms will catch on globally so we don't have to worry about restricting ourselves to one or the other. --Habst (talk) 14:08, 8 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

As far as I am aware, ‘track and field’ is not widely used to describe any aspect of the sports of athletics in countries which refer to the sport as such—-least of all the stadia in which it’s events take place. There may well be minute differences between the predominantly geography specific definitions but that’s not called in to question here. Rather, it is the terms by which a stadium used for athletics is called: an athletics stadium is the correct nomenclature in locations that call the sport “Athletics”. SteadyJames (talk) 22:01, 8 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

Please see how the stadium is referred to in this article: Crystal Palace National Sports Centre SteadyJames (talk) 22:05, 8 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

@SteadyJames, OK, I agree with you about "track and field stadiums", and have   Done that change in Special:Diff/1218037576 as well as adding {{use European English}} (which is currently just a redirect to {{use British English}}). But on this, ‘track and field’ is not widely used to describe any aspect of the sports of athletics in countries which refer to the sport as such — I think websites like this https://www.trackandfield.co.uk/ would indicate otherwise, no? Thanks for the suggestions. --Habst (talk) 10:26, 9 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

It's peculia. There are a few references to to 'track and field' outside the US. I even found one on the England Athletics website (adjunct or junior to UK Athletics) although the page in question is a few years old and in references to a team competing in a solitary competition, which was still listed as 'Athletics' on the same page. In regards to the reference you shared, the 'track and field' part is a brand name: "Track & Field Tours", not an event. Again, the resource refers to the services provided by the company as "athletics events and training camps'. Therefore, I maintain that the name 'track and field' is not used widely outside the US, and thereafter seldom used to describe the sport itself and relating activities. However, I'm happy to change my mind if evidence is brought forward.

With this in mind I propose that, for the sake of continuity and clarity, all other instances and references to 'track and field' on this page are simplified to 'athletics', as again, this is the common name for the sport in the language used on this page. SteadyJames (talk) 17:16, 9 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

@SteadyJames, thanks, I think you make a good argument. I'm prepared to replace all mentions of "track and field" from the article (except for the one at the end of the lede that explains the regional term), but then what would you propose we replace the term with? In the article, "track and field" is mostly described as a component of athletics, so it wouldn't make sense to replace it with "athletics" and then the article would be saying "athletics is a part of athletics".

My ideas all don't sound too great:

1. "in-stadia athletics"

2. "running and field" (sounds too much like track and field)

3. "track running and field"

4. "60 metres through 10,000 metres, jumping, and throwing events" (way too long)

5. "stadium athletics"

I think number 5 might be the best sounding one, but I'm not sure if I can find enough cites that it would be well understood. --Habst (talk) 17:27, 9 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

Let's be too hastey... I've done some more digging and have found contemporary use of 'track and field' by several organising bodies outside the US, including the organising bodies in Scotland, England (but curiously not UK Athletics), and Australia. https://www.scottishathletics.org.uk/; https://www.englandathletics.org/competitions-and-events/national-championships/; https://www.athletics.com.au/home/.

What's interesting to me is that there seems to be a total absence of the term in the press and among the wider populations in those countries. Indeed, the common catch all name remains athletics in all location in the press and for locations, local teams etc. Therefore, there is a decision to be made here about the specificity of nomenclature, especially as there is absolutely no reference to the 'track and field' on the World Athletics website; the org doesn't appear to make a distinction between in-stadia, road, etc events... I don't think wikipedia recognises 'official names', but I'm unsure how various names for the same thing is handled. SteadyJames (talk) 18:05, 9 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

@SteadyJames, interestingly when naming their World Athlete of the Year award winners for 2023, World Athletics uses the terms "track" and "field", but not together (so close!): https://worldathletics.org/awards/news/world-athletes-year-rising-stars-2023. They also use the term "out of stadia" as a catch-all to describe all non-track-and-field athletics events. So we have a term that means the inverse of what we want, but not the acual thing.

(They also (rarely) use the "track and field" term in some of their news, e.g. in https://worldathletics.org/news/feature/22-standout-moments-2022-track-field-season, but this seems like an exception.)

I think the reason that press and wider population in Europe doesn't use "track and field" is because they usually don't require the level of precision that an encyclopedia needs to accurately categorize and describe its various aspects; in casual conversation, you can tell what's being meant by context but we can't really rely on that on Wikipedia. --Habst (talk) 18:22, 9 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

I broadly agree with your last post. Contrary to my last proposal, I’m now against further changes in light of evidence. SteadyJames (talk) 18:45, 9 April 2024 (UTC)Reply